Ongoing dental woes


@tsech
 

I am having ongoing dental issues with my ~6 year old holland lop, Seymour, and am wondering if anyone has any thoughts or advice. He had never had dental issues until about 8 months ago, when he went off his food and seemed uncomfortable chewing. He had some molar spurs, which were trimmed, and got back to normal pretty quickly. This same thing happened again about 2 months later, and then again ~6 weeks after that. He also received x-rays and had bloodwork done to rule out infection or other issues. After the third trim, he did not go back to normal eating despite his teeth looking fine, so I took him to another vet for a second opinion. She suggested that there could be an issue that was not showing up on x-rays, so he had a CT scan to look at his teeth in more detail. The CT did not show anything too obvious, but that maybe a couple of his molars are not growing super straight and could be causing him some discomfort. The vet does not think an extraction is needed at this point, so he received another molar trim in an effort to correct his bite.

It's now been 2 days since that trim and he's definitely still uncomfortable and not wanting to eat. I know that he will probably be in pain for a few days after the trim, and he's currently getting Gabapentin, Meloxicam, and Sucralfate for that. I should add that he's been on the Gabapentin and Meloxicam for about 6 weeks, since his third molar trim. With that pain management regime, he was able to eat pellets and some chopped-up greens (but no hay). I guess my question is, does anyone have experience with this sort of mystery dental issue? It arose so quickly and it still seems unclear what the main problem is or what a good long term solution could be. The treatments he has received so far have been insanely expensive :S Also, now that he's been on a modified diet for almost two months, and has not been eating hay, I am wondering what the best way to encourage him to eat hay again is. Should I slowly cut down the amount of pellets he is receiving so that he's hungrier? Should I wait until he is finished his pain meds to do this? I really just want to make sure that he's getting enough food for now. I also worry that the medications he is on are affecting his appetite, etc. 

Any advice or recommendations much appreciated! 


Nancy Ainsworth
 

Hi Talia,
It is possible, like Dana mentioned, that there is a problem spur hiding back there. Some bunnies are so sensitive that the tiniest spur throws them off. Also, the whole sore mouth from the dental procedure (having their mouths opened so wide, unnaturally). Are you syringe feeding him during this phase? Also, out of curiosity, what is his weight and what dose of meloxicam is he getting?
Nancy 


-----Original Message-----
From: talia.sechley@...
To: main@etherbun.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Aug 5, 2021 11:25 am
Subject: [Etherbun Main] Ongoing dental woes

I am having ongoing dental issues with my ~6 year old holland lop, Seymour, and am wondering if anyone has any thoughts or advice. He had never had dental issues until about 8 months ago, when he went off his food and seemed uncomfortable chewing. He had some molar spurs, which were trimmed, and got back to normal pretty quickly. This same thing happened again about 2 months later, and then again ~6 weeks after that. He also received x-rays and had bloodwork done to rule out infection or other issues. After the third trim, he did not go back to normal eating despite his teeth looking fine, so I took him to another vet for a second opinion. She suggested that there could be an issue that was not showing up on x-rays, so he had a CT scan to look at his teeth in more detail. The CT did not show anything too obvious, but that maybe a couple of his molars are not growing super straight and could be causing him some discomfort. The vet does not think an extraction is needed at this point, so he received another molar trim in an effort to correct his bite.

It's now been 2 days since that trim and he's definitely still uncomfortable and not wanting to eat. I know that he will probably be in pain for a few days after the trim, and he's currently getting Gabapentin, Meloxicam, and Sucralfate for that. I should add that he's been on the Gabapentin and Meloxicam for about 6 weeks, since his third molar trim. With that pain management regime, he was able to eat pellets and some chopped-up greens (but no hay). I guess my question is, does anyone have experience with this sort of mystery dental issue? It arose so quickly and it still seems unclear what the main problem is or what a good long term solution could be. The treatments he has received so far have been insanely expensive :S Also, now that he's been on a modified diet for almost two months, and has not been eating hay, I am wondering what the best way to encourage him to eat hay again is. Should I slowly cut down the amount of pellets he is receiving so that he's hungrier? Should I wait until he is finished his pain meds to do this? I really just want to make sure that he's getting enough food for now. I also worry that the medications he is on are affecting his appetite, etc. 

Any advice or recommendations much appreciated! 


@tsech
 

Thanks, Nancy and Dana.

The vet used a scope/camera to view the back of his mouth during the procedure so I'm pretty confident that they were able to check everything out carefully. They were specifically looking back there since he had still been uncomfortable after his previous trim and suspected the issue was in the back of his mouth. 

He is eating on his own (pellets and a bit of greens), just is not interested in hay yet and is still eating slower/more carefully than usual. He had been off his hay for a few weeks while we were waiting on the CT scan appointment, so I think part of the problem is that he is now used to his new diet. He will also eat critical care out of a dish, so I've been giving him a bit of that. His appetite is there, just not the will to eat hay. I want to give him a few days to recover from the dental procedure, but then plan to back off on the pellets and critical care in the hopes of getting him hungry enough to munch on hay again. He is very stubborn! 

He's about 1.9kg and is on 0.5cc meloxicam 2x/day, along with 0.4cc gabapentin 2x/day. He's been on this regime for about a month while waiting for this latest dental appointment, so I'd like to get him off the pain meds soon in case they are affecting his appetite and energy. 


bunnylv109 <beata_payerhin@...>
 

Hello Talia,

When my bunny got his dental exams, his exotic vet always did it under a mild sedation to be able to see the very back of his mouth.  Otherwise you really cannot see well unless the bunny is very chill and forgiving.  If his vet did not sedate your bunny, maybe you could ask her/him if she/he was able to see the very back molars.  In the meantime, I would suggest supplementing with critical care (try to mix it with a little bit of pure pumpkin to see if your bunny will not eat it on his own.  Mine loved it that way!)

Hope this helps!  Wishing your bunny all the best!

Beata  (Angel Yogi 💕)


From: main@etherbun.groups.io <main@etherbun.groups.io> on behalf of Nancy Ainsworth via groups.io <jtawired@...>
Sent: Thursday, August 5, 2021 12:29 PM
To: talia.sechley@... <talia.sechley@...>; main@etherbun.groups.io <main@etherbun.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Etherbun Main] Ongoing dental woes
 
Hi Talia,
It is possible, like Dana mentioned, that there is a problem spur hiding back there. Some bunnies are so sensitive that the tiniest spur throws them off. Also, the whole sore mouth from the dental procedure (having their mouths opened so wide, unnaturally). Are you syringe feeding him during this phase? Also, out of curiosity, what is his weight and what dose of meloxicam is he getting?
Nancy 


-----Original Message-----
From: talia.sechley@...
To: main@etherbun.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Aug 5, 2021 11:25 am
Subject: [Etherbun Main] Ongoing dental woes

I am having ongoing dental issues with my ~6 year old holland lop, Seymour, and am wondering if anyone has any thoughts or advice. He had never had dental issues until about 8 months ago, when he went off his food and seemed uncomfortable chewing. He had some molar spurs, which were trimmed, and got back to normal pretty quickly. This same thing happened again about 2 months later, and then again ~6 weeks after that. He also received x-rays and had bloodwork done to rule out infection or other issues. After the third trim, he did not go back to normal eating despite his teeth looking fine, so I took him to another vet for a second opinion. She suggested that there could be an issue that was not showing up on x-rays, so he had a CT scan to look at his teeth in more detail. The CT did not show anything too obvious, but that maybe a couple of his molars are not growing super straight and could be causing him some discomfort. The vet does not think an extraction is needed at this point, so he received another molar trim in an effort to correct his bite.

It's now been 2 days since that trim and he's definitely still uncomfortable and not wanting to eat. I know that he will probably be in pain for a few days after the trim, and he's currently getting Gabapentin, Meloxicam, and Sucralfate for that. I should add that he's been on the Gabapentin and Meloxicam for about 6 weeks, since his third molar trim. With that pain management regime, he was able to eat pellets and some chopped-up greens (but no hay). I guess my question is, does anyone have experience with this sort of mystery dental issue? It arose so quickly and it still seems unclear what the main problem is or what a good long term solution could be. The treatments he has received so far have been insanely expensive :S Also, now that he's been on a modified diet for almost two months, and has not been eating hay, I am wondering what the best way to encourage him to eat hay again is. Should I slowly cut down the amount of pellets he is receiving so that he's hungrier? Should I wait until he is finished his pain meds to do this? I really just want to make sure that he's getting enough food for now. I also worry that the medications he is on are affecting his appetite, etc. 

Any advice or recommendations much appreciated! 


bunnylv109 <beata_payerhin@...>
 

I just saw your reply which addressed most of what I wrote, sorry about that!
I am thinking that his mouth/cheeks might still be sore from the procedure to eat hay, so hopefully he will start soon.  My Yogi had molar trimming only twice in his 11+ years of life but every time it took some time before he would feel comfortable eating as usual.  Let's hope that's the case with your bun as well!

Hang in there!  Best wishes to him and to you! 


From: main@etherbun.groups.io <main@etherbun.groups.io> on behalf of talia.sechley@... <talia.sechley@...>
Sent: Thursday, August 5, 2021 12:40 PM
To: Nancy Ainsworth <jtawired@...>; main@etherbun.groups.io <main@etherbun.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Etherbun Main] Ongoing dental woes
 
Thanks, Nancy and Dana.

The vet used a scope/camera to view the back of his mouth during the procedure so I'm pretty confident that they were able to check everything out carefully. They were specifically looking back there since he had still been uncomfortable after his previous trim and suspected the issue was in the back of his mouth. 

He is eating on his own (pellets and a bit of greens), just is not interested in hay yet and is still eating slower/more carefully than usual. He had been off his hay for a few weeks while we were waiting on the CT scan appointment, so I think part of the problem is that he is now used to his new diet. He will also eat critical care out of a dish, so I've been giving him a bit of that. His appetite is there, just not the will to eat hay. I want to give him a few days to recover from the dental procedure, but then plan to back off on the pellets and critical care in the hopes of getting him hungry enough to munch on hay again. He is very stubborn! 

He's about 1.9kg and is on 0.5cc meloxicam 2x/day, along with 0.4cc gabapentin 2x/day. He's been on this regime for about a month while waiting for this latest dental appointment, so I'd like to get him off the pain meds soon in case they are affecting his appetite and energy. 


Nancy Ainsworth
 

Hi Talia,
I'm glad he's eating pellets and some greens and some Critical Care on his own. If you're able to get or have a variety of hays to offer him it might be an interesting experiment to see if there's a type he gravitates to. I would even try some alfalfa just to see if he CAN eat it. Usually it's irresistible and the most discerning bun will end up eating stalks and all, and then you can segue into a little alfalfa/grass hay mix and so on and sort of fool him into getting back into a hay routine. There's a pretty wide variety of textures out there with hays - something may peak his interest, it just may mean mixing it up a bit to see what appeals to him in his current state. Also, I've had good luck with Small Pet Select's Flower Power Berry Boost medley sprinkled onto hay - they go for that and come to find they are then eating the hay along with it. :) 
Good luck and please keep us posted on how your little guy does!
Nancy


-----Original Message-----
From: talia.sechley@...
To: Nancy Ainsworth <jtawired@...>; main@etherbun.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Aug 5, 2021 12:40 pm
Subject: Re: [Etherbun Main] Ongoing dental woes

Thanks, Nancy and Dana.

The vet used a scope/camera to view the back of his mouth during the procedure so I'm pretty confident that they were able to check everything out carefully. They were specifically looking back there since he had still been uncomfortable after his previous trim and suspected the issue was in the back of his mouth. 

He is eating on his own (pellets and a bit of greens), just is not interested in hay yet and is still eating slower/more carefully than usual. He had been off his hay for a few weeks while we were waiting on the CT scan appointment, so I think part of the problem is that he is now used to his new diet. He will also eat critical care out of a dish, so I've been giving him a bit of that. His appetite is there, just not the will to eat hay. I want to give him a few days to recover from the dental procedure, but then plan to back off on the pellets and critical care in the hopes of getting him hungry enough to munch on hay again. He is very stubborn! 

He's about 1.9kg and is on 0.5cc meloxicam 2x/day, along with 0.4cc gabapentin 2x/day. He's been on this regime for about a month while waiting for this latest dental appointment, so I'd like to get him off the pain meds soon in case they are affecting his appetite and energy. 


Margaret Suchow
 

Hi
You might want to feed critical care until he eats hay


On Aug 5, 2021, at 12:48 PM, bunnylv109 <beata_payerhin@...> wrote:


I just saw your reply which addressed most of what I wrote, sorry about that!
I am thinking that his mouth/cheeks might still be sore from the procedure to eat hay, so hopefully he will start soon.  My Yogi had molar trimming only twice in his 11+ years of life but every time it took some time before he would feel comfortable eating as usual.  Let's hope that's the case with your bun as well!

Hang in there!  Best wishes to him and to you! 


From: main@etherbun.groups.io <main@etherbun.groups.io> on behalf of talia.sechley@... <talia.sechley@...>
Sent: Thursday, August 5, 2021 12:40 PM
To: Nancy Ainsworth <jtawired@...>; main@etherbun.groups.io <main@etherbun.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Etherbun Main] Ongoing dental woes
 
Thanks, Nancy and Dana.

The vet used a scope/camera to view the back of his mouth during the procedure so I'm pretty confident that they were able to check everything out carefully. They were specifically looking back there since he had still been uncomfortable after his previous trim and suspected the issue was in the back of his mouth. 

He is eating on his own (pellets and a bit of greens), just is not interested in hay yet and is still eating slower/more carefully than usual. He had been off his hay for a few weeks while we were waiting on the CT scan appointment, so I think part of the problem is that he is now used to his new diet. He will also eat critical care out of a dish, so I've been giving him a bit of that. His appetite is there, just not the will to eat hay. I want to give him a few days to recover from the dental procedure, but then plan to back off on the pellets and critical care in the hopes of getting him hungry enough to munch on hay again. He is very stubborn! 

He's about 1.9kg and is on 0.5cc meloxicam 2x/day, along with 0.4cc gabapentin 2x/day. He's been on this regime for about a month while waiting for this latest dental appointment, so I'd like to get him off the pain meds soon in case they are affecting his appetite and energy.